Hi,

My first post. I would like to check that I dont need a license because its up for renewal on the 31st of this month. I have given it much thought and our situation is as follows

LCD digital tv
analogue lcd tv
projector
LoveFilm account

Games consoles,
wii, xbox360

1 x computer
1 x netbook
(no tv card in either)

broadband internet

I would like to spend the £145 license fee on a network streamer, ie Popcorn Hour, WDtv etc that sort of box.

Only tv we will miss is Dr Who but can use catch up or hire from lovefilm or blockbuster. Talking of blockbuster, watched Fringe the whole first series last week for £6, so my thoughts are for the amount of programs we actually enjoy its far cheaper to hire or just watch online.

We wont need a license anymore will we?

thanks for your time and help

Welcome to the forum, Mr Chuckle-Dick.

I was in the same position, some years ago. My licence renewal was due on the 31st July, but I wrote to them, since I didn't want to be bothered by their threat mail and their visits.

If your TV set is not connected up for live TV reception, then you're OK with not having a TV licence. I suggest that you do not do what I did, which is to withdraw implied right of access to TV Licensing. My experience is that this did not stop the visits.

I anticipate you will receive their threat mail monthly from now on. They will let the situation rest for a couple of months from the expiry of your TV licence - expect a TVL visit sometime in October. If this visit does not satisfy TVL, expect another visit just before Christmas.

Do not allow them access to your home, no matter how favourable this seems. You will not benefit from this. No need to tell TVL anything about your equipment setup. As a best option, ignore the TVL visitor(s). If you do feel obliged to talk to him/them, tell him/them that you have no need of a TV licence, that they have no business at the property, and to leave. No need to answer their questions - no need to give explanations. Don't let them control the conversation (if it happens). Just be blunt. If they won't leave and continue to be a nuisance, a phone call to the police is appropriate.

Thanks Gerald. I appreciate your time and advice. I will have nothing to hide. Im not an evader. This year im just not going to qualify to the terms and conditions to owning a license. I will be disconnecting my ariel lead completely. I understand this is not necessary but as its not a hassle I may aswell cover all bases seeing as im led to understand tv licensing are not very nice people.

I will also reset the digital tv to manufacture defaults so it is detuned. Im assuming but will check that this is enough to render the set unable to receive a broadcast.

The other set is analogue so should be fine but I will tune it out just to be sure.

I'll also give away the only freeview box in the house so there will be no receiving equipment other than the detuned digital tv which will be used for games consoles, internet, internet catch up, and dvds.

If this is not enough to keep me legal I dont know what is

I hope they dont come looking for trouble. I am not a weak man and will not be set upon but I will be taking the best course of action and not entering communications with them as they have no business with me as I have no contract with them and do not wish to buy one.

Wish me smooth sailing


edit- I also wont bother to tell them I dont need a license this year as frankly its none of their business. Its not like im jumping to another provider where knowing would help them in their business model.

Just to be on the safe side , make sure you de tune your tv channels, tape up end of any aerial etc

Just be aware that they may say you need one for Iplayer as you "MAY" watch streaming programmes as they are broadcast, or you may need one for that smartphone you (may not) have...
So best advice is after doing what you say, ignore them as suggested by Gerald.
You only then have to let them in in the unlikely event of them gaining a warrant.

Maybe the police should arrest me as my pc is also capable of viewing porn of the underage variety yet I dont!

what ever happened to - until I commit an offence there is no crime?

stokewhites,

thanks im removing the ariel lead completely. Its no trouble and if TVL did get a search warrant they would find no ariels, no leads into the house and no freeview boxes so their only recourse would be possession of a computer with intent to view iplayer to which I would reply in court - your honor there are many arrestable things I could do with a pc so you may aswell charge me for those whilst your at it! and what if I asked for my IP records from my service provider to prove I never watched iplayer live? they would have no case.


What I also find crazy is that some have been convicted by tvl sticking their fingers in an aerial socket. Am I led to believe they actually say to a judge "your honor one member of the household would stand with a finger in the hole whilst the others watch"?
surely this is grasping at straws and any magistrate that convicts on such a find is clearly not fit for purpose!

What I also find crazy is that some have been convicted by tvl sticking their fingers in an aerial socket. Am I led to believe they actually say to a judge "your honor one member of the household would stand with a finger in the hole whilst the others watch"?
surely this is grasping at straws and any magistrate that convicts on such a find is clearly not fit for purpose!

[/quote]

Sadly, as you will learn as you browse this forun 'tis true, they have used the "finger aerial" to gain convictions.

With regard to a PC I feel the premise is dodgy, as they need a mens rea (criminal intent) to convict, and I think to satisfy the rules of evidence the programme would have to be actually being viewed when they called (if they were let in ), but remember, the magistrates are brainwashed to accept the dodgy evidence from TVL, without question. You could password the BIOS to prevent the PC starting and even reaching Windows login, and unless they invoke RIPA ( do they even have that power? No they do not so a demand for a password can be safely ignored) you can refuse them the password. Use Linux, that is likely to confuse them.

Set up cctv to record them at the door with a big sign to the effect that they are under surveillance, if they call, that usually sends them away when they realise they are being filmed. as to the legalities of domestic cctv: this from the ICO website answers that:

Q: My neighbour has installed a CCTV camera and it is pointing towards my house/garden. Is this a breach of the Data Protection Act?

If your neighbour’s camera is installed on their residential property and being used for their own personal domestic use, they are unlikely to be breaching the Data Protection Act. This is because the use of CCTV cameras for domestic security purposes is exempt from the data protection principles. This applies when a person uses CCTV to protect their home from burglary, even if the camera overlooks the street or other areas near their home. If your neighbour is using CCTV for business purposes they will need to comply with the Act. If you are concerned about the use of domestic CCTV it may be worth contacting your local police. For more information, contact our helpline or read our CCTV code of practice.

http://www.ico.gov.uk/Global/faqs/data_ ... 8DE2D7446C

For the Original Poster

Ex TVL employee quote


Source….Mail Online, 9 July 2008 ( comments section ). MY BOLD


Regarding the 'finger aerial', (in mine and many friends family and associates experience).

What 'they' do, is bluster their way in, and if you have, say, cut or removed the aerial lead, they will use the 'finger aerial' and then dramatically announce that ' Ah HAA !! your 'equipment CAN receive and display 'live broadcasts'.
For the unrehearsed or uneducated, (in this subject), this will usually be enough to FRIGHTEN the VICTIM into a confession and subsequent conviction.

( BTW a metal pen or a key works better, but remember, only on 'old' CRT equipment, my experiments on 'pure digital' equipment using this technique proved that getting a picture in this way is impossible),

In my case last year, a DVD was displaying a VERY CLEAR picture, and the 'finger aerial' was used to convince the accompanying 'professional witness', ( by inference) that I had somehow 'corrupted' the signal after the initial 'test'.

I now have 'pure digital' equipment,( that is not connected to an aerial ), so this tactic will not work.

IMHO this is what will 'kill' the Beeb after the digital switchover, because the simple act of cutting or removing the aerial lead, accompanied by a legitimate reason for having a TV in the property, ( DVD, Playstation, CCTV usage etc), IMHO SHOULD keep you 'legal'.

Regards

M.Shakey

So presumably Shakey, an analogue tuner only LCD/plasma will not respond to the finger aerial, where the signal has been switched to digital either? And so unless someone signs the "interview (confession)" sheet, which the occifer later alters to an admission, they should be OK?. So the general consensus of zero contact unless they get a warrant is the best advice.

Yup.....but dont leave it to chance, (like I did last year, well 2008 to be precise), a simple experiment will reveal the answer, (try it yourself).
With more areas recently 'going digital', our supporters who live in the 'digital only' areas who have already 'switched', can feed us back this vital info.
Remember that MOST people DO NOT ATTEND COURT, and I am sure that this goes a long way when the 'finger aerial' is used, and the accompanying 'interview form' is presented, (duly signed), as 'evidence'.


Well you have made some very good points in such a short post, there is no 'catch all, silver bullet' solution, but...... on the whole......no contact will suit most people and will work in most situations.

The main factor in our favour is that it is almost impossible to prove what someone is doing in the privacy of their own home......
.......unless detector vans work......

Shakey

Yup.....but dont leave it to chance, (like I did last year, well 2008 to be precise), a simple experiment will reveal the answer, (try it yourself).
With more areas recently 'going digital', our supporters who live in the 'digital only' areas who have already 'switched', can feed us back this vital info.
Remember that MOST people DO NOT ATTEND COURT, and I am sure that this goes a long way when the 'finger aerial' is used, and the accompanying 'interview form' is presented, (duly signed), as 'evidence'.

Thanks Shakey

Our area has switched over to digital and my LCD is analogue only, I have tried a finger aerial, borrowed next doors set top aerial, and cannot get a thing, so the only option for obtaining a picture is if the sneaky git brought one of those Freeview in a scart thingies, and plugged it in, he would have to unplug the scart from my analogue VCR, to connect it though and also disconnect the DVD player to access scart 2. As I would be filming him if they got a warrant, and he did this, I think that this would be prima facie evidence of "Perverting the course of Justice".
As those who have gone over to Freeview around here have found, the signal is now worse and they need a rather large high gain outside aerial to get anything, so even a finger or key in the scart freeview would get nothing.

TV all detuned. I selected to retune it to France. It came back with no channels. Digital or anolgue. Also before that I factory reset it. Now I goto digital tv and I have zero channels in the list. on analogue I have 1 channel. number 1 it says and it has no info or anything. You'd have to be a right dick to find anyway to say I need a license as the tv is clearly not tuned to anything. aerial cable also removed for good measure. They have no business in my home